wait and listen.....NAMM

dr_floyd · Post by **dr_floyd** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 5:07 pm

Wow, that Encore sounds great. But it has a RISC processor and DAC, so it's not as strictly analog as I would guess the Moog would be. But the audio samples do more to confirm a Mooger Freq Shifter than deny.

Don't know who Amos was addressing with his marketing comments, but a Frequency Shifter is pretty daring as it can really screw around with the audio. A Guitar Synthesizer or Pitch Tracker are much less daring than a Frequency Shifter too, and the former target a much smaller potential user base.

Also, Moog could call it the Mooger Super Freak or something to match the Lil Phatty type name.

Found the Wendy Carlos thing. It is very cool.
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/henry01/fr ... 1_filt.htm

museslave · Post by **museslave** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 5:17 pm

The Carlos sample is pretty danged cool... but it wouldn't be very long until you had to search pretty hard to find ways to implement that sound... especially if you were involved with tonal music.
But, I guess it's the same as with a ring modulator... it's a cool sound with limited use, but people still seem to love them. : ) Hell, I do.
I'd even be pretty thrilled about a frequency shifter, provided you had a little more control over it than it sounds like this sample does. It's a little like a filter with a sinewave controlling the cutoff point... it's much more exciting if you can do things like variable waveforms, sample and hold, CV control, etc. than just that sinewave going up and down. So, perhaps... if Moog is making a frequency shifter, it's one that allows a variety of cool controls over the effect.

OysterRock · Post by **OysterRock** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 5:18 pm

dr_floyd wrote:Wow, that Encore sounds great. But it has a RISC processor and DAC, so it's not as strictly analog as I would guess the Moog would be.

I don't think you could physically fit a fully analog FS in a moogerfooger case, they require a LOT of circuitry.

The digitally generated oscillators aren't such a bad thing in this case and certainly are the best solution for reducing cost, size and complexity.

eric coleridge · Post by **eric coleridge** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 5:21 pm

sir_dss wrote:The Encore Electronics Frequence Shifter is like $389. Just put a pre amp in infront of it and go...

http://www.encoreelectronics.com/cont_fs1.html

Yeah, I've thought about this Encore module for my modular (that I'm currently building). But like people have said here, it seems like kind of a compromise...
Incidentally, Club of the Knobs is running a special on their Bode FS clone module right now (it's still nearly $1000):

www.cluboftheknobs.com

I don't know how Moog could make a FS at a MoogerFooger price, when they cost well over $1000 from every other manufacturer. Plus, I don't know why a FS should be marketed as a specifically guitar-synth-like effect (no more or less than a ring mod or env filter anyway). But it would be very cool if they do.

dr_floyd · Post by **dr_floyd** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 5:40 pm

Maybe "boundary-defying" means genius-engineered to be reasonably priced. Didn't Dr. Moog say the circuits spoke to him, so who knows what they told him toward the end.

The "Club of the Knobs" Bode FS looks like it would fit a Mooger footprint, doesn't it?

And did I miss something? Is there someplace the new Fooger is being marketed as a Guitar Synthesizer? I have the Roland GR300, SPV355 and other pitch followers triggering Moogs and they don't sound anything like the teaser audio file.

MC · Post by MC » Thu Jan 11, 2007 6:00 pm

I've laid eyes on the guts of a Bode/Moog frequency shifter.

If the COTK module is a direct clone, it will NOT fit in a moogerfooger case.

The Encore FS might fit, because the RISC/DAC solution reduces a LOT of precision tuned circuitry.

KitsuneDarkStalker · Post by **KitsuneDarkStalker** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 8:31 pm

LOL, sounds like someone spilled coffee on a DX7...

CTRLSHFT · Post by **CTRLSHFT** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 11:33 pm

sounds like a guitar synth to me, with sync functionality available. lots of ring mod sounds going on too.. wonder whats driving it, and if this demo may be including other foogers into the equation.

i really hope it's controllable via cv / gate inputs so it can work as a modular osc / env component as well. it definitely has something envelope related just based on the attack of the sounds.

can't wait to see, regardless!!!

dr_floyd · Post by **dr_floyd** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 11:45 pm

CTRLSHFT
Can you tell me what guitar synthesizer you've heard that sounds like this? I just don't hear it at all, outside of the obvious use of a guitar as source.

I just doesn't make sense to me that Moog would make a guitar synthesizer, it's not in their experience/knowledge base.

CTRLSHFT · Post by **CTRLSHFT** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 11:54 pm

dr_floyd wrote:CTRLSHFT
Can you tell me what guitar synthesizer you've heard that sounds like this? I just don't hear it at all, outside of the obvious use of a guitar as source.

I just doesn't make sense to me that Moog would make a guitar synthesizer, it's not in their experience/knowledge base.

didn't say i've heard one that sounds like this before, but the way the guitar is mixed and how the raw osc sound is following the guitar, i'm pretty sure this is it. an env generator syncable to the pitch of the osc could be part of the sound.

maybe a dedicated osc or lfo AND an octave divider used to follow pitch of an external source?

Moog is catering to guitarists in a huge way. i think this is the next logical step to fusing the synth and guitar worlds together a bit. the whole moogerfooger line exudes this confidence. why else would they have made individualized units, shaped like stomp boxes?

i think this machine will double as both a p-v controllable osc (or lfo), and a guitar synth via an octave divider, based on the sounds i'm hearing.

just a guess! jan 17th will reveal all..

godzilla · Post by **godzilla** » Fri Jan 12, 2007 12:41 pm

don't know a lot about the freq shifters, but they look interesting!

so they use a sinewave?

maybe this new pedal is an FS with a selectable waveshape VCO (not just sinewave) that you can use as a normal VCO or drive the FS or both!

Kevin Lightner · Post by **Kevin Lightner** » Fri Jan 12, 2007 12:56 pm

I think that it's possible to build a FS into a MF case if it was all surface mount.
That said, I haven't listened to the demo or have any inside info as to what it is.
There are many unique ways of mangling sound.
If a guitar signal was split, one side distorted and the other side clean, then both into a ring mod or other multiplier, it could do some pretty whack things too and stay all analog, etc.
Just too many possibilities to speculate, but the marketing is obviously working- we're talking about it!

godzilla · Post by **godzilla** » Fri Jan 12, 2007 1:02 pm

cool idea but you can already do it with the cp 251 + any distortion pedal

eric coleridge · Post by **eric coleridge** » Fri Jan 12, 2007 1:38 pm

Guitar Groove-box sequencer with VCOs

Who's taking bets?

I don't really hear the synth following the guitar or bass in this track. When the guitar signal decays, there is a synth playing the same note, but it's hard to tell if it's following the guitar.

I think there is definitely other Moogers in the track, because the bass is being env filtered, and theres alot of ring mod like sounds.

But where are the osc sync/ frequency modulated sounds coming from?

dr_floyd · Post by **dr_floyd** » Fri Jan 12, 2007 3:35 pm

Based on the track I would bet there is:

No VCO (in the traditional sound-source sense)
No Sequencer
No Pitch to Voltage Converter
No LFO
No guitar synthesizer

To me the teaser track sounds like all one device, I can't identify any other Moogers, closest being the Ring Mod, but sounds different. The osc sync sound is what sounds more like Freq Shifting to me. There seems to be some sort of envelope follower with a decay stage. Some of the almost-random harmonic changes sound to me like maybe something is tracking harmonics as they change over time.