New CP-Enclosure-Style Moogerfooger Units 101-104 (mock-ups)

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CTRLSHFT
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New CP-Enclosure-Style Moogerfooger Units 101-104 (mock-ups)

Post by CTRLSHFT » Sat Feb 10, 2007 6:12 pm

I thought it'd be fun to do some measurements between the CP units and the normal pedal-type moogerfoogers and see it if would be feasible to make CP-style enclosure moogerfoogers instead of the cumbersome pedal-type ones. Admittedly, Moog would probably never make these, as it would be a little redundant, and purely for the synth and modular enthuiasts.. but then again, moog seems so be doing alot of cosmetic makeovers on their production line lately (custom voyager wood and LEDs, etc).

All of these images are scaled to be exactly compatible with the size difference between the CP and Pedal-Type MF enclosures. I left the dual attenuators in on the right hand side because: A) They're aesthetically pleasing and placed perfectly for compatibility in the I/O chain. B) Extremely useful in a modular setup. They might add a slight increase in the price would Moog ever consider creating these, but i think it'd be nominal in comparison with the benefits.

How do you folks feel about a design like this? I would like to think moog has a pretty good user base for these devices by now, so at least they could probably count on a fairly good response (i know i'd be all about trading up for versions like these instead.)

p.s. i might be inclined to make mock-ups of the 105 and 107 once theres diagrams available. otherwise it's pretty time intensive, so i'll probably pass. use your imagination though, i'm totally confident they could convert those units to CP-style enclosures too! i should also mention that the stomp switch for bypass on these mock-ups was traded up for a simple switch like that which can be found on the mf-105.

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also: here's a image at how'd they'd feel in a rack unit, just for fun. i included my mock-up for a ADSR-type CP-Unit, and a illustrated cp-251 in there for kicks. :wink:
Last edited by CTRLSHFT on Thu Dec 24, 2009 5:44 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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OysterRock
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Post by OysterRock » Sat Feb 10, 2007 6:53 pm

Sweet! I'd love to have this option. Probably not likely to happen, but a fun idea none the less.

Hey, CTRLSHFT. What software are you using to make these mock-up? They are very well done.

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Post by CTRLSHFT » Sat Feb 10, 2007 7:05 pm

OysterRock wrote:Sweet! I'd love to have this option. Probably not likely to happen, but a fun idea none the less.

Hey, CTRLSHFT. What software are you using to make these mock-up? They are very well done.
Yeah, you're probably right. But I can dream in the meanwhile. ;)

re:design - Thanks! All of my mock-ups are done in photoshop, usually based off the black and while draft-type diagrams provided on the moogmusic site.
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Post by analoghaze » Sat Feb 10, 2007 8:03 pm

Fantastic idea. I am sure these would sell if Moog were to produce.
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Post by c7sus » Sun Feb 11, 2007 7:19 am

Looks great. The only thing I would add is a jack for FX on/off stomp switch.

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Post by latigid on » Sun Feb 11, 2007 3:31 pm

c7sus wrote:Looks great. The only thing I would add is a jack for FX on/off stomp switch.
Just a thought: You could replace the switch with a jack. For guitar users, add a foot switch. For "synth" users, just insert/remove a blind jack to turn the unit on/off respectively. Then you could use a CV gate to turn it on and off... Or, sell seperately a jack that has a (foot)switch attached directly to the other end!

Perhaps the jacks for the delay could be spaced the same as the other pedals. That way, it would be a little cheaper, as all units would have the same footprint.

One good thing about the CP-style enclosures from a production view is that they don't have curves, which I would guess would make them cheaper.


Keep up the good work,

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Post by CTRLSHFT » Mon Feb 12, 2007 11:22 am

latigid on wrote:
c7sus wrote:Looks great. The only thing I would add is a jack for FX on/off stomp switch.
Just a thought: You could replace the switch with a jack. For guitar users, add a foot switch. For "synth" users, just insert/remove a blind jack to turn the unit on/off respectively. Then you could use a CV gate to turn it on and off... Or, sell seperately a jack that has a (foot)switch attached directly to the other end!

Perhaps the jacks for the delay could be spaced the same as the other pedals. That way, it would be a little cheaper, as all units would have the same footprint.

One good thing about the CP-style enclosures from a production view is that they don't have curves, which I would guess would make them cheaper.


Keep up the good work,
i like this idea alot, good call.

square-wave lfos on the pedal in would be sweet, too! :twisted:
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Post by electrical_engineer_gEEk » Mon Feb 12, 2007 12:43 pm

From an engineering design standpoint this is a cool idea but actually way more expensive then you might first guess as a musician.

Unless the PCB of the moogerfooger line is all headers and cables these boxes would have to go through a "from scratch" PCB redesign to rearrange all of the ICs,Rresistors, Pots and Jacks. It was also a good idea that you kept all of the POTS/SWITCHES in the same location on each box so that when the punch the holes in the metal they can do in a mass production manner. I'd really like to see how a moogerfooger or CP looks inside.... I wonder if they mount all their external hardware on PCBs or choose to mount everything on the case and solder wires to the lugs.
Anyone have some pictures of the guts?

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Post by CTRLSHFT » Mon Feb 12, 2007 1:13 pm

electrical_engineer_gEEk wrote:From an engineering design standpoint this is a cool idea but actually way more expensive then you might first guess as a musician.

Unless the PCB of the moogerfooger line is all headers and cables these boxes would have to go through a "from scratch" PCB redesign to rearrange all of the ICs,Rresistors, Pots and Jacks. It was also a good idea that you kept all of the POTS/SWITCHES in the same location on each box so that when the punch the holes in the metal they can do in a mass production manner. I'd really like to see how a moogerfooger or CP looks inside.... I wonder if they mount all their external hardware on PCBs or choose to mount everything on the case and solder wires to the lugs.
Anyone have some pictures of the guts?
no pix, but i've racked everything, so i've seen the guts. it's all on pcbs, as far as i can see, nothing looks soldered to the case.. the I/O is just screwed in with some (iirc from racking the cp-251's, which require WAY more work) plastic bits. i'm not sure how the pots/stompswitch get connected from the metal base on to the PCB, though.. doesn't seem like it's wired together.

also: the pcbs are nigh EXACTLY the same height/length (normal foogers' pcb's are bit smaller, so they seem like they'd fit perfectly) of the cp-units. that's actually what really triggered me to make some mock ups.. the feasibility. i don't doubt that they might cost a little more, if nothing else for the r&d needed to produce them. i just figured since they already have an existing enclosure design, as long as the pcb layouts don't need to be tampered with too much, it might be something possible.
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Post by eric coleridge » Mon Feb 12, 2007 7:33 pm

electrical_engineer_gEEk wrote: I wonder if they mount all their external hardware on PCBs or choose to mount everything on the case and solder wires to the lugs.
Anyone have some pictures of the guts?
Most all of the hardware is PCB mounted. The PCB itself is held in place by the pot and jacks' screws-- which keeps it locked onto the outer enclosure. I think the second teir of jacks are wired to the PCB, as well as the stomp switch....

The only thing I would wonder is if some of the PCBs (like the phaser for instance), which are quite large, would even fit into that portion of the CP-style enclosure-- as in CNTRLSHFT's design. If so, it seems like it wouldn't take a whole lot of re-design to make this idea work.

You know CNTRLSHFT, you can actually buy empty CP-251 enclosures from Moog Music for like $25. The only problem is that they are already pre-drilled and screen printed. But if your MF-B line designs would accomodate the pre-drilled holes of an existing CP-251, you could fairly easily make a prototype. You'd just have to paint over the existing legends... and re-print your own.

I guess the rocker switches would present a problem...

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Post by CTRLSHFT » Mon Feb 12, 2007 10:15 pm

eric coleridge wrote:
electrical_engineer_gEEk wrote: I wonder if they mount all their external hardware on PCBs or choose to mount everything on the case and solder wires to the lugs.
Anyone have some pictures of the guts?
Most all of the hardware is PCB mounted. The PCB itself is held in place by the pot and jacks' screws-- which keeps it locked onto the outer enclosure. I think the second teir of jacks are wired to the PCB, as well as the stomp switch....

The only thing I would wonder is if some of the PCBs (like the phaser for instance), which are quite large, would even fit into that portion of the CP-style enclosure-- as in CNTRLSHFT's design. If so, it seems like it wouldn't take a whole lot of re-design to make this idea work.

You know CNTRLSHFT, you can actually buy empty CP-251 enclosures from Moog Music for like $25. The only problem is that they are already pre-drilled and screen printed. But if your MF-B line designs would accomodate the pre-drilled holes of an existing CP-251, you could fairly easily make a prototype. You'd just have to paint over the existing legends... and re-print your own.

I guess the rocker switches would present a problem...
the phaser actually would fit very comfortably inside of a cp-251 (interestingly enough, i measured that specific MF prior to responding to your last comment!). the pcb's dimensions are something like 8.0" X 4.75". the I/O placement could present a problem, but at least the actual pcb dimensions would work.

didn't know that moog sold enclosures seperately, neat! i'm not nearly savvy enough (or rich enough, cuz i'd probably fry/break it) to attempt somehting like that just yet, but building a prototype would be fun :)
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Post by matt the fiddler » Mon Feb 12, 2007 10:30 pm

If you mount it in a smaller module [for rack mount], you could always hang it at 90 degrees.


if you pull the circuit board out you can test it on a piece of cardboard or paper to get a protype pattern. and then take a [cheap] piece of sheet metal .. drill and mount away :)

there are a lot of peopel who build their own modular modules that wing it :)
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Post by matt the fiddler » Mon Feb 12, 2007 10:40 pm

auctually i just got an idea looking at my old 101


the jacks go slightly more than 1" into the enclosure.

right above the stomp switch near the moog logo... you can drill soem holes [where it is still deep enough- the stop swictch it's self is too shallow]


you could move the jacks to this location...

It would take desoldering/ and moving, then adding leads to 5 plugs [ on the 101] and then repositioning the 2 movable ones

you can easily get 2 rows of plugs down there where it is still deep enough...
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Post by matt the fiddler » Mon Feb 12, 2007 10:53 pm

oops.. bad image link. hold on...
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Post by eric coleridge » Tue Feb 13, 2007 1:41 pm

matt the fiddler wrote: you could move the jacks to this location...

It would take desoldering/ and moving, then adding leads to 5 plugs [ on the 101] and then repositioning the 2 movable ones

you can easily get 2 rows of plugs down there where it is still deep enough...
I once thought about doing this also, but because there is already a drilled hole for the stomp switch (square in the middle of this space), you couldn't make the other jacks line up correctly...

You'd either have to have an odd spaceing of jacks, or fill in the hole where the switch was and work around it.

Either way, it wouldn't look very nice. I've come to appreciate the aestetic choices made on the MFs and wouldn't really want to sacrifice that even at the benifit of having more accessible jacks... not a trade off I'm willing to make.

I've also considered mounting my MFs behind modular panels and adding them to a home built modular (that I'm very slowly working on)... But then I'd lose the easy portability that they now provide (which I also appreciate).

I really like this idea of CNTRLSHFTS though, a line of all CP251 style enclosures... attentuators on each module would also be a huge benifit to the MFs...

I really think CNTRLSHFT should start consulting for Moog Music... these are really good ideas and exactly what alot of people seem to be wanting...

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